Inc... Tribunal pls (split topic)

[Ughbash]

[WaringMcMarrin]

[Jerus]

I keep my own cure up aftre dying to that multiple times.

[Kiru]

For me, the question of whether or not to buff someone with Tribunal is an easy one to handle. Unless I've seen the raid leader call for Tribunal or the lead shaman asks me to buff it, I won't. If someone asks for it when it hasn't been called for, I politely reply that Tribunal is a group buff that hasn't been called for yet and I don't want to buff-lock the other members in your group (except for this one time when I just said "no").

If we haven't done MGBs yet and someone asks for buffs that's likely to be MGBed, I'll mention that I think it'll be MGBed and suggest they ask again later if they aren't. Other buffs I'll go ahead and cast, though, unless I know that one of the other shaman has a stronger version and is likely to still have buffs up. Then I'll redirect the person to that shaman for those buffs.

I'll buff late-askers if we haven't engaged yet or haven't started moving to the fight spot. Otherwise they get "after this fight" or "when we get to the fight spot" or "after I'm done slowing" (if I have time to type, that is). If I forget afterwards, they'll send me another request and I'll apologize about forgetting and then buff them.

[ThraallFV]

My favorite is when a shaman i am with casts tribunal in a situation when it has ZERO value. I know i am the first to click it off. i havent gotten to the point were i tell them they are stupid but it has crossed my mind. I dont mind buffing i do not like buffing things that have no value (agility back in the day, charisma 99% of the time)

[Ughbash]

Well USUALLY I am good about getting buffs, but well last night I messed up.

We were doing "Talk to the King" to get FC raid access.

Usually I do not pull (monk) because my computer is subpar and I lag like a snail in Valdholm instance. However the usual puller had an emergecny come up and right past gate we needed to clear trash from the room with 5 named. (First time you kill king). Well I went to train left side room with all named to allow the other puller to pull right side room, and due to lag (thats my story) I died. Was rezzed in right before we charged all the named.

Now as I was looting my corpse buffs were landign on me liek crazy so I wasn't really paying attention to everythign I got, quick glance showed my hp somwhere in the right area so when we charged about 20 seconds after rez effecsts faded I jstu went right in. (I had been trying to sit and med til then). SO I am DPSing on the king while the raid leader is saying MORE DPS, and I am lamenting the fact I don't ahve champion or bard overhaste when I start lookign at the rate of speed my hits are scrollign by. Hmm this seems awful slow I shouldn't be missing this much. Starts looking at buffs, no haste.

/tell Enchanter_01 "I am a moron and missed the fact I didn't get haste after rez could you please haste me when you get a chance"
Enchanter_01 tells you "in a moment"
/tel Enchanter_01 "No hurry, my own fault for not seeing it earlier"
Enchanter_02 tells you "Speed inc"
Attacks go up to a more normal rate of speed.
/tell Enchanter_02 "thanks"

Anyways just wanted to point out that ANYONE can make that mistake, and sometimes not even notice til engaged, but Usually if you are polite and not /tel buffer_01 "damn you why don't I have Useless buff_01 don't you know how to play your toon?" most people are generally willing to help out as time/mana allows.



Edit: Now why we had 4 Enchanters on at that time when of the 5 named only 1 can be mezzed is beyond me Cues the tape for Enchanter_correspondent to complain (in this case justifiably) about enchanters not really stacking on raids.

[Unmei]

[Kilgaroz]

[Ughbash]

[Kianor]

[Kilgaroz]

[Tineren]

If I'm a slacker and forget to ask for haste before engage, I click a haste potion. If I forgot other buffs, I just do without.

[Unmei]

The question remains though; Is the raid better off if someone gives him the buff...or not?

It all comes down to timing. Engage time is the wrong time to ask for buffs. Engage time is -also- the wrong time to be a snit and not do your all to make sure people are ready.

[Samanna]

[Gwaeron]

[Rexis]

[Kiru]

If the MT asks you for buffs before the order to engage, then I agree that buffing him is the right thing to do.

But if the MT asks you for buffs on incoming, then the right thing to do is to do the job that you're supposed to be doing (malos, slow, hot, panther, heal, cure, whatever), and then buff the slacker who wasn't doing his job when he was supposed to.

Unless you have so many shaman on the raid that it doesn't matter if one of them briefly stops doing the same job that all the other shaman are doing to buff the slacker MT.

I've never been in a raid where the MT asked for a buff on incoming, though. I have had the raid leader hold up the order to pull or engage in order to get the slacker MT buffed (in one case the slacker MT was the RL, who was so busy with the strategy session that he forgot that he had died on the previous named).

[Veril]

[Ganrin]

My main is a ranger (I believe thats called slacker dps in this thread). Due to real life work situation I generally join the raid about 2 hrs in, and by some unnatural freek of coincidence I usually reach the raid on inc for whatever the current boss mob target is.
Knowing my situation I try to get whatever raid buffs I can before I log at night, and if not I carry Haste potions and go with haste plus self buffs till I can aquire raid buffs by tell. I also haste pot and reengage if im battle rezed, then start with requests for buffs "as you can fit them in".

[Ughbash]

[jdthomas]

[Galelor]

[XeroOmega]

[Samanna]

[Kianor]

[Catmandew]

[Fenier]

Personally, I am the Raid Leader for my guild.

I expect people to keep normal buffs up, if you need something special, I'll be sure to let you know and you should have it before pull.

I also give a time limit to get buffs done, and I stick to it, at that point, I will inform the pullers to bring the mob to us or trigger the event, because I am assuming you listened to me and got what you needed when I told you to. If, by any chance you missed it, then you go without.

I would like to think our healers are not stupid, if you're fighting, say Rikkukin and the person takes several 5k avoidable AEs in a row, for god sake, let the person die instead of wasting mana, and they do. If you are taking an above normal damage intake due to the fact you can't move on a consistent basis, or make sure you have the correct buffs, your survival for the encounter becomes a distant second to making sure the healers maintain a mana level to complete the encounter at all.

I think, in the past six months of raiding, we've only wiped twice due to people not having buffs because of slacking, and that was in the first month. When people know that death is pretty likely for them if they don't make sure they are set, they are much more inclined to pay attention.

If people are holding up your raid for buffs consistently, then they are wasting everyone's time, which I find unacceptable if you want to have a decent amount of loot intake or encounter attempts on a given evening.

A good example of this is Ikkinz 4. My Guild can clear this in just over 75 minutes, from zone in to Keeper of the Alter death. A similar (slightly higher) content guild can do Ikkinz 4 also, but it takes them 3.5 hours. Which is more effective? Is it better to push ahead when you know you can beat content even when 1 or 2 people are not 100% ready (or dead even?), or is it better to beat the encounter and move on to something else, thus allowing for further advancement?

-Fenier

[ThraallFV]

[Spetsnas]