Spell Casting Subtlety AA

[wuma]

[Mead]

[wuma]

[Scalia]

[Zaviax]

[Tordail]

You might try looking over thread on SCS.

I have SCS3 and like it.

[Scowls]

I like it, it allows me to do more dps without attracting agro. Im not always in a group with a massively over powered high agro tank, and thats where it really shines. its not a game breaking AA, it just helps us stay under the radar a little longer than without it. It does make it more difficult to get agro when the tank dies and i want to save th cleric, but you can ramp up agro with reslow and cripple pretty quick/

[Mead]

[Samanna]

[Beafly]

SCS3 has significantly increased my early slowing capability. It is a godsend. I used to wait for tanks to take a few hits before I slowed. Now I slow as soon as the mob rounds the corner. As far as saving other casters with your uber agro, Let the casters who can't tank take some hits when they get agro (it's called tough love, they'll learn). No need to snap agro back from them, just toss them a heal instead (you are a priest). And I've duo'd with a rogue from my guild and still had no problems holding agro while tanking. Not taking advantage of these AA's is what doesn't make sense to me.

[Veril]

SCS3 is great, if I need aggro I spam the cripple line of spells. Othewise SCS does what I want it to do.

[Pecannius]

Doesn't it feel like we get a post like this every month or 2?

Well anyways, whether you get SCS or not depends on your playstyle. I play aggresively and love being on the verge (and sometimes over) aggroing the mob.

For high end warriors (that know what they're doing) and have a BBoB/epic2.0, it's very hard to steal aggro from them in raid encounters. I mean, 8 dots with nukes I rarely get summoned on tunat 1.0.

High end knights (that know what they're doing) shouldn't have any problems keeping aggro.

The problem comes when you have a warrior with poor aggro weapons (epic 1.5 and Chaotic Black Schimitar or worse). If a warrior has no hate mod (qvic gloves, time bp, epic 1.5 or 2.0) then you're screwed too.

Overall, in the high end, it's just more fun not to have scs and very rarely do I wish I had it. It is a fact you can aggro off clerics/robe-wearers easier, which comes in handy quite a bit, but also depeonds on your playstyle. If you play very aggresively like me, you are more likely to enjoy the benefits of having no scs.

For low to mid players, scs is very, very good. With mobs hitting pretty hard, no one likes to be one/two rounded. Scs will help you stay off the aggro list and live! Also, when dealing with warriors who are without BBoB/epic 2.0s, you are probably better of with scs than not.

There is no right answer for scs, everyone plays differently.

[Ungkor]

[Scowls]

same for my guild ungkor, scs3 required. and epic doesnt affect the agro generated by anything that doesnt affect hps (only nuks heals and dots), slow and cripple get no agro reduction from it.

[Samanna]

That cracks me up. They can code that focus to not modify agro from slow/malos but still work on heal/dot/nuke, but GoM is still wasted on 0m spells. /boggle.

[Brohg]

doesn't work on dots, only heals & nukes

[Macnair]

[Veril]

[Samanna]

[Scowls]

Q2 bukes and heals apparently, dots are unaffected...

Q3: doest SCS behave the same way, or does it truely affect all spell hate equally? very hard to tell in game, would probably need a dev to answer that one

[Brohg]

He was making the point badly, is Veril's counterpoint The implied answer to Mac's rhetorical Q's were 1) that debuffs and dots cause the most agro, and 2) are the two not affected by epic focus. Those two answers combine to make his point that the epic focus is bad. That's faulty, though, since the point is predicated on an answer that's not actually a given. Like people who claim a resist mod of neg60 on chaincast Balances... but can't chaincast Balance.

[Macnair]

Meh, my rhetoric isn't as spiffy as I had in mind, I can see.

Veril is right that when I cast a quck spot heal on the tank, three other mobs might decide to come over and squash me. Which they probably won't do if I slow or dot or cripple some mob other than themselves.

On the other hand, if the offtanks aren't asleep, those other three mobs are getting picked up pretty quick. If the offtanks are asleep, the three mobs are busy killing one of the clerics first, because he already cast a quicker bigger heal than my little spot heal.

But in the odd case where the offtanks are asleep and the cleric is also asleep, it could be that the focus on the epic saves me from getting eaten by those three mobs.

On the other other hand, shamans get aggro from slowing on incoming all the time; and from casting cripple all the time; and from DoTting all the time.

Before I got epic 1.5, I was not able to generate enough aggro from blast healing to get summoned and splatted as long as the tank was alive. So the effect solves an aggro problem that wasn't there: it just guarantees what was already true.

Before I got epic 1.5, I regulary got summoned and splatted from debuffing and DoTting, even though our tanks were aggressively working on holding aggro. Ganking aggro is less common now, because tanks have better tools, but it still happens. So there was an aggro problem before from debuffs and dots, and the effect on 1.5 doesn't help it. The effect is busy solving a problem that wasn't there, and doesn't do anything for the problem that is still there.

So what I should have said is that 1 and 2 are how we routinely get summoned, and 3 and 4 are spells that rarely get us summoned. So the effect helps us in the place that we really didn't need the effect.

[Veril]

I otend find it amusing to answer rhetorical questions, especially in a why that is not expected.

Aggro generally isn't that much of a problem, unless you use cripple, pretty much our tanks, sk, paladins, rangers hold aggro over me malos/slowing and then nuking. I generaly don't bother with DoT's mobs die too fast.

As for aggro from DoT's, it's now a non-issue IMO. Doing the Hanvar event, I stack the top 5 poison DoT's on hanvar and do a rain - once all the adds are dead. I only get summoned if I get two full poison ticks in the 10 second stun time.