Shield AC Discussion ... devolves into tanking argument

[Brohg]

[Brohg]

[Jooruus]

[Beafly]

[Veril]

The only thing better than lots of ac is lots more of ac

[Tharkis]

[Galelor]

[Bigsnack For'Mobs]

There is NEVER enough AC!

[Veril]

[Ughbash]

[Galelor]

[Unmei]

[Samanna]

[Jaraman]

[Fandele Longtooth]

[Samanna]

[Kianor]

[Ughbash]

[Unmei]

[Jooruus]

[Jooruus]

[Jaraman]

[Samanna]

[Tharkis]

[Jaraman]

[Cronikk]

[Ughbash]

[Samanna]

[Unmei]

[Brohg]

Unmei, Vow of Valor and Ward of Reprisal are more than somewhat relevant, too, if you'd like to bring specific spells into this. Vow in particular cuts mob dps by 200ish unresistably, regardless of what dps they start at.

[Unmei]

[Jaraman]

[Brohg]

Jaraman, you haven't refuted any arguements for pages now, and the analogies are getting gross besides random & off base. All you keep saying over & over is that you like to tank, and you group with clerics that don't. You mem the agro tools you have, they don't mem the agro tools they have. Nothing about that situation makes shamans better tanks than anyone. It doesn't even make you a better tank than anyone, it just makes you a more *likely* tank.

Summary thoughts for this post:
repetition != retort.
don't be gross, it doesn't help.

[Jaraman]

As I've already stated redundantly, I'm done playing around with Unmei, though it was fun for me at least.

And at least you're consistent as well, Mr. Brohg.

[Veril]

Clerics have better AC, and better returns for their AC than shaman have. Cleric spells are making them significantly better at tanking. I don't bother to even try the AoW, I don't believe I could make any sizable dent in it's HP before I ran OOM.

Right now, I feel that clerics outtank me, quite significantly. Equivalently geared and attitude clerics are better than me for tanking. Doesn't stop me from trying, but I have to accept the reality.

[Scowls]

I grouped with a cleric who loves to tank almost daily. If i gave her sloth she maintained agro longer than me, but i could take it easily by casting spells in a different order (sting, dot, dot, sting...instead of malos, dot, wait, hot, wait, sting). clerics make good tanks, yes, but their agro ability is definatly weaker than a shamans, our spells have more agro generation, between slows, dots, and nukes; and much lower recast times. she tanked, IF i let her have agro. She got mad cause with her not tanking, VoV wasnt dpsing mobs...after a while she realized my dots was more dps than her VoV, the mobs i ganked agro died faster than hers.

clerics "generally" itemize heavily on mana, their gear leans on more mana than hps, and they generally have mana augs instead of hp augs (they cannot regen mana as fast as shaman, so rely on a massive pool before going oom..shaman go massive hps and canni/SC)

cleric gear has higher AC, yes..but their soft cap is low like ours, with similar defensive skills. clerics have the advantage of their near instant cast heals (shield, promised renewal, AA hots)...but TSS gave shaman an edge on those, upgrading ancestral aid, and adding union.

Shaman and clerics both make decent off tanks, especially when over geared for the situation (you wont see many of either soloing ashengate or frostcrypt for a while). both have unique abilities and stratgies to getting the job done. it used to boil down to letting the cleric heal/nuke while i tanked, atleast if i die they can finish me off and rez me, but call of the wild changed that. although i cant count the number of times the cleric has died and i healed/CC'd/off-tanked thru and rezed them after in groups.

Maybe it boils down to shaman having an AC aug in their shield, and cleric having a mana aug in theirs (to put the thread back on track)

[Tugela]

[Tugela]

[Tugela]

[Jooruus]