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The Spirit Realm • View topic - Fan Faire Report! (updated with the rest!)

Fan Faire Report! (updated with the rest!)

General Discussion for the EverQuest Shaman.

Moderator: Shaman Mods

Fan Faire Report! (updated with the rest!)

Postby Gloriana » Sun Apr 09, 2006 2:11 pm

First - let me cross post the questions from the "ask the developer thread":

Your questions answered!

nameless.Cocodrilo
Will there be more items that unlock potion belt slots?

Zajeer answered - Yes, he plans to put more higher level items in game that will unlock potion belt slots.


XeroOmega (so good to meet you!)

are there any plans to add more port-potions to the game?

Maddoc answered - Under consideration.

not really shaman specific, but why put so many hard-hitting see-invis mobs in the way of travelling to many instanced missions? specifically when travelling to Razorthorne, and a handful of other missions in the most recent expansions.

Maddoc answered - There are plans to look into this and modify if necessary.


siludorf

Siludorf had quite a few spell related/class balance questions that I asked Prathun. The questions were complicated, so I told Prathun I would email him the questions when I got home for more in-depth review.

Here are the questions:


1st Question:
If a raid mob is designed to resist spells at a balanced rate with Malosinia, Tash and Hos taken into account, does it not put shaman, who do not have resist checks on their dots or nukes, at an inappropriate disadvantage?

Prathun said - Raid mobs shouldn't have high resists so that most spells just don't land.

2nd Question:
If priest (cleirc, druid, shaman) hps are supposed to be roughly equal based on the hps/mana on the class only anguish armor, (285hps/300mana) for anguish cleric/shaman/druids bracers for example; and with canibalization being a 2k dd, and regular canni being a 900hps dd, are shamans not in effect, sitting at *least* 1k hps bellow their counterpart priests at all times? How is this sort of balance justified vs ae's and other things that may be happening during a raid.

Prathun said - where would the extra hitpoints come from? Possibly a question for Zajeer (itemization). He mentioned that shaman typically share wis (cleric/druid/shaman) gear drops.

3rd Question:
Clerics have a group heal over time 900 / tic, with a 2.25s recast time. Shaman have a group heal over time 630 / tic, with a 18s recast time. When it takes 6 seconds for a heal over time to even have any affect, what is the justification for the recast time, considering one of the shaman's primary roles at raids is to um-mem spells in order to buff.

Several shaman were around when I asked Prathun this question and we were all very interested in the idea of losing the recast on Ghost of Renewal.

4th Question:
Shaman had a unique ability that cost 9AA's and can be used every 2 minutes. Now rangers have a similar spell, half the knockback but a reuse time of 6 seconds and almost unresistable. Are there any plans to fix VP, that is to make it chromatic and to reduce it's recast time? Or to add additional AA that will reduce it's casting time and/or make it harder to resist?

Oshran answered - He was not opposed. I will follow up with an email.

5th Question:
Given that SoE believes that mana regeneration is balanced with spell casting times and spell costs and given that SoE believes that 100/74.5/65 ratio of heals is balanced.

Will follow up with Prathun via email.

Are shaman not losing out on their ratio of heals within a given interval when they need to stop healing in order to regenerate mana, yet the other 2 priest classes do not need to stop. (Regenerate mana includes cannibalizing and healing that canibalized mana).

Prathun said this was a class balance issue. The other priests have no way to get back mana back quickly like shaman do.


baguetteovenfresh

I am wondering when shaman will get the get out of jail free card that almost every class (excepting mage, beastlord - who might have some evasive disc for all i know) in the game has. We are the only class that have simply no way to reduce our aggro or flat out escape it entirely for a period of time whereas every other class has this. Can we at least get a parry type buff, or dull pain?

Discussed this with Oshran. Possible change to our defensive AA. I will follow up in email since the guy just took over AAs last week!


Gandel

Any chance for a group Harnessing of Spirit spell?

Prathun answered - he said that sounds reasonable.


Bigsnack For'Mobs

Will the Devs reconsider making our epic 1.5/2.0 range equippable (secondary is possible but only if the AC is adjusted a lot and it is made a "shield")? It's very frustrating to do all the work and basically get an inventory clicky.

Zajeer answered - he said no.


fuzzy

Is there any consideration to changing the rules and re-tuning LDoNs so that they may be soloed? Or making the LDoN only spells available through some other means?

There was discussion about balancing re-tuning LDON points to make them more in tune with current equipment cost.


Maxpower

why are PoK potions the only ones that can be made 5 at a time? (besides the obvious 5 vials in the recipe compared to the 1 in the rest)

Maddoc answered - he said one of the issues might be the 10 slot alchemy container. We'll talk more about it.


Henora

Is there any chance of getting additional filters for buffs wearing off pets? I'd like my pet to be able to use bard songs and auras, but the spam is just out of hand. It would be nice to be able to seperate spells wearing off MY pet.

Nome answered - he will look into it.

Are the problems with illusions and auras being worked on? There are severe problems with targetting with the mouse when you are illusioned and using an aura.


Uh, this was mentioned but I didn't write anything down for some reason. I will try to find out, sorry!

Any plans for increasing the number of effects that can fit in the short term buff box? In my regular group (bard, warrior, cleric, shaman, rogue + 1) we are often overflowing the box now.

Nome answered - he will look into it.

Kerowen

Question: Why can you use the Magus in the guild lobby to travel places but cant travel back to the guild lobby?

This question came up during the summit. General dev consensus was they were willing to look into it.


Serj

Why don't Anguish boss mobs drop 2 quest armor pieces?

Zajeer answered - this is by design.

Why do PoR boss mobs have what seems like an endless number of hps? Porthio being a prime example of this. Once you figure out the fight and have everything under control it shouldn't take 30-60 minutes to beat the encounter because the mob has insane regen or his hps are through the roof. Yes, shamans shine in fights like this, but it's just not fun anymore.

Oshran designed this encounter and he said there was a bug for Nightshade where he was regenning a ton but this has been fixed. He said that the mobs should have a normal number of hitpoints for raid mobs.

Henora

Are there any plans to expand on the guildhall?

This came up quite a bit in summit and panels. They are definitely interested in adding to the guildhall, it was created so it could be expanded on (extra doors upstairs, for example). Two things that were mentioned as possibilities - zone directly to bazaar and the possibility of earning trophies for first kills that could be hung and displayed.

HuacaWuaca

I asked a few years ago at a Fan Faire about putting in missions or something so you could change your deity. The devs said they liked the idea and would pursue it, but haven't heard anything since.

Maddoc answered. He said this is unlikely since deity has a lot of important ramifications to character profile.

Also, I wish you could have a suffix with either your deity or starting city.

Maddoc answered. He said this was not unreasonable, but no plans.

fendaann

I tihnk the real issue is finding second way to get LDoNs points for each camp.
maybe the Camps can have Single Tasks quests for LDON points and not go into a instances and hunt in a real underused zones. I don't think the DEV want to creat instance zones for singles.
But RGC and other Sham spells we need the points to get them


There were a lot of discussions about improving LDONs. I mentioned this, but no definite answer.

Beafly

Are there plans to remove the apparent limit on the number of Audio Triggers we can have active at a time?


Discussed this with Jamie Ryan and Nome - they were interested in exactly what you meant by "active" so if you could follow up with me in a PM, that would be great. They said it wasn't unreasonable, one of the issues is around resource limit.

Kneesmasher

I would like to be able to memorize more than 10 spell sets. Do they plan to expand spell sets you can Mem from 10 to maybe 20?

Nome answered - he will look into it.

Cereall

Why can't shrouds equip all/all armor, or class specific items that associate with that class (i.e., using rogue shroud should be able to equip a rogue dagger bought in the Bazaar)? As of now, using a shroud is practically pointless. A level 70 "cleric" shroud can't begin to compete with even a badly equipped Bazaar cleric.

Maddoc answered. All/all armor has the potential to increase shroud power too much. Current balancing is based on shroud specific armor.

fendaann

I never use scale of Wolf, takes to long to load up, it has the breakage, why can't the, load be shorter.

Prathun answered - willing to look into it (part of the downtime rebalancing, shouldn't be unfun to mem spells)


Catmandew


I am probably the only one in the game that uses the potion Distilate of Health, but is there any way that SOE could look at the amount of HP this increases base by? Looking at the Clarity line of potions, the X level is a 14mana per tic increase, same as KEI, but the Health potion is a base increase of 468hp, which is not even Temp level, a 40 level spell, much less Virtue, which is about the same level spell as KEI.

Maddoc answered. He didn't think comparing KEI and Virtue was a fair comparison for the potions.


shamuofxev
removal of the "load spell" recast penalty would be my biggest wish. there's always one ranger that wants champion just that second, and doesn't grasp the 1 min delay even if I load it right away

talked about this a lot with Prathun - how annoying it is to have to keep spells memmed at all times. It might be part of the balancing with champion, but I will follow up with him in email.


Other - not sure who submitted these, sorry!

Related to above champion spell. If spells could have timers like the epic. To see long recast spells in your spellbook halfway grayed out and ticking back to active status.

maddoc answered - Too resource heavy for the character file.


Why can you bind in the guild lobby, not the guild hall.
Maddoc answered - it is instanced. if the instance wasn't up, gate would fail.


Fan Faire

I took a ton of notes! A lot of my notes are just short bits of information. Fun stuff that was discussed:

As mentioned in other reports - Prathun is the new "spell guy" and Oshran is now responsible for AAs! They were pretty new to their new roles, so I'm going to follow up with them in email with additional AA/spell details.



Downtime

There was a ton of discussion on how to make the game more fun, most importantly the issue of downtime. There is a lot of interest in an out of combat vs. in combat regen (mana/health/endurance). Looking at code for feasibility, trying to figure out how to prevent possible exploiting (wizards unloading mana bar, then logging out to reset to "out of combat mode" - for example). Vahlar said it was possible that after all the discussion/planning for regen is done, there may be other ways to regen endurance in game. It was confirmed however, that extinguish fatigue will not be used to regen endurance in the future (not Vahlar, but I forgot who)

Making the Game Fun at all Levels - how to get new people interested?
The next expansion will be 1-70. The possibility to completely level up in the new expansion (new starting city). Possibility of seeing higher level features at lower levels - auras, AAs, etc. Possible improvements to death penalty - currently it is much more harsh at lower levels than it is at higher levels. Possibility of having options on death - spawn with all gear for exp penalty, return to corpse with less of an exp penalty, etc.

Progression Server
I know this has been discussed a lot in other write-ups, but it sounds very interesting. Basically, the server would start with the original Everquest and more content would be unlocked as expansions are defeated. For instance, the server would not start with Frogs or Iksar or Vah Shir, these options would come available as their respective expansions became available. There was some discussions about POK and the bazaar and whether or not these options would be available from the beginning or not. Shadowrest would be available at the beginning but there was discussion about corpse summoning before the guild lobby becomes available (maybe the Priests of Discord could summon bodies?) The exact criteria to unlock expansions was also not defined. No transfers to the new server in the beginning and maybe not at all. The tutorial would still be available but would need to be retuned so the tutorial quest rewards would not be unbalancing. It would not be a "classic" server, it would be a "progression server"


Random:

* Stat caps - diminishing returns past cap. How to improve?
* More immersive experience - auras, traps, they want to work towards an environment that's more immersive. Maybe defending destructible objects? Evaluate traps, make them more useful.
* Possible to outrun an aura, but it is server lag. You don't actually outrun the aura according to the server. (server is slightly behind and updates every server tick).
* Currently f8 picks up traps, idols. How to fix.
* Short term duration buffs - now that auras, epic clickies, bard songs, etc etc. go in the short duration buff box, might need to expand to more than 12 slots.
* Auras are considered spell effects, not character particles.
* Bard aura range - 100, all other auras - 200. Mistake or design?
* Curt Schilling is the leader of the top guild in EQ2. (I just thought that was interesting)
* How do you block buffs that don't leave an icon? Like mod rods.
* Modify buff block list for group vs. raid (in groups you might want BSS, in raids you might want ranger buffs)
* Better UI - one hotkey to unlock/lock all windows at one time.
* Atlas - Adding color-coded zone names based on player level, icon for current zone population, zone descriptions (points of interest), possible to put group leaders on maps
* Tracking - improve tracking to be more visual. Possible to share tracking with group members?
* Losing chat on zoning - the chat cache filter is capped. If you lose in game chat, you might be at the filter cap. Plan to merge all in game chat to the Universal Chat System. The Universal Chat System was unstable lately due to some upgrades. Should be much more stable soon.
* Possibility to set up aliases - for example. I could set all my alts on my account to receive tells directed to my main. If someone used ;tell gloriana while I am on my cleric Amalthea, I would still get the tell if I wanted to (must respect player's right to stay private on alts, if desired)
* LDON/DON rewards - the more its used, the reward lessens. Less used content would have greater rewards. Encourage players to move around, not focus on the "easiest" content.
* Are AAs too easy to get now? Compare earning an AA at 70 to earning an AA at 60. What will it be like at 75? How can they improve the AA system. Larger # for cost? Change the cost itself? How will lower level players earn AA if it is implemented pre-50? What about expendable AAs? Buy an AA ability and use it, must buy again.
* Rashere said that there were issues with taunt which are being resolved. Currently on test.
* Moderate guild chat? Only officers can talk?
* LOTD - when you die it's gone - by design. Possible of shortening the recast to 22 hours (possible to use it every night comfortably)
* Problems casting levitation on lower level players. The only lev that will hit is the one that requires bat wings, who wants to carry around bat wings?
* Got a chance to see a demo of the updated Nek forest on Maddoc's monster laptop. Looks completely beautiful. It will match the original Nek zone layout and geography and the newbie log will still be there. The entrance to Neriak was particularly stunning.


Tradeskills

* DoD fletching - blood drops didn't happen. Code change has not happened, no ETA
* Smithing/shadowscream - Ngreth says no plans to update drops. Prefer new methods to work on smithing.
* Success caps for OOW augs and grandmaster smithing - lift cap? change trivial? Answer - it is intended to make it accessible to anyone, it may be changed in the future.
* Trophies - possible to combine trophies into one trophy? Answer - currently no way to have one item affect multiple skills.
* Rogues - make traps to sell? Answer - not a bad idea, Vahlar wouldn't say never.
* Mistletoe cutting sickles - trivial has not changed.
* Tailoring - nothing has been improved since solstice robe nerf. Ngreth said there is plan to improve the path to improv tailoring for the next expansion.
* Shaman get foraging? Ngreth answered - nothing alchemy related needs foraged items anymore.
* Tinkering - more items need to stack. Gnome bolts are too rare. Ngreth said gnome bolts should remain rare.
* # of learned recipes is capped (either 100 or 500) if you want to add recipes, you must delete some.
* OOW spell research - possibility. LDON also.
* Alchemy endurance regen - Ngreth to consult with team.
* New poison cures have a recast. Before, it was 80 counts cured in 20 seconds. That was much too fast and was not the intention. It is currently 44 in a single cast, 1 minute recast.
* POK - tradeskill containers are not Tanaan. Considering whether or not to remove that restriction.
* Rogue poison - balance issue, can't add a ton of DPS to rogues.
* Future of tradeskilling for visible armor/robes - linked to new models.
* There are many sub combines where unlimited quantities can be purchased - want to be able to make many subcombine results at one time. It can be more expensive, to save time not money. Maddoc said - there are limitations with the size of the combine containers (10 slots)
* Waring – wider variety of buffs in a bottle, like a lower level of symbol? Ngreth – the goal is not to replace a player in a group. Potions should be good for soloing, the developers want to be careful of what alchemy buffs enter the game.
* Will there be another expansion-wide TS quest like Aid Grimel? Right now, the TS team is working on fixes. They want to, but not sure when.
* Spirit of Cheetah potion – long recast time. This would be a great way to give shaman the spell without the ridiculously long load time.
* When crystallized sulfur was added to the CS drop table, did it take the place of pelts? Banut used to get 25-30 pelts an hour, now just gets 15 an hour. Ngreth will look into it, it wasn’t supposed to affect pelt drops.
* Vahlar works with spell designers to create spell names that fit the expansion lore. There was a question for a monk discipline (I think) – who is Kanji (sp?)
* Tinkerers want TS AAs like Alchemy and jewelcraft. Developers looking into it.
* Developers are considering bringing mystical aptitude and the +3 mana regen potions back.
* Forage bots – Ngreth says that adding forage to other classes/races is a huge class balancing issues. He said that most tradeskills should be updated to no longer rely on foraged components.
* Will there ever be an ability to research melee skills?
* Ground spawns in Kaladim – mushroom drops are uneven (5/7) want an even number of mushrooms to spawn (6/6) Developers looking into it.


Items and Spells

* Wizard trap spells “big pile of crap” – Prathun is looking into all POR spells to ensure they are worth casting.
* LDON gear – Zajeer said they are looking at the cost of low end items and the problem of outleveling the items while trying to earn them.
* Beserkers need a de-aggro ability. Prathun to look into it.
* Wizards – want an upgraded Harvest spell and say POR root spell is useless.
* Leather and chain drops rot, silk and plate are too rare. Zajeer to look into it, drop rate should be proportional based on # of classes.
* More sources for epic 2.5 pages – Prathun to look into it.
* Wizards want to reduce aggro. Rashere said that wizard damage is balanced around mana and aggro.
* Enchanters want more illusions. Rashere said this is an issue with the global memory file. May be a possibility in the future.
* Bards want new mod caps – bring instruments back into use.
* Paladins – why use the 70 stun when it is nearly identical to the 66 stun (but costs more mana). AOE stun spells are also wanted. Prathun to look into.
* Druids want an animal only slow. Under consideration.
* Idol of Malos is currently targetable. Nome to look at possibly making the idol an NPC character, not a PC character. Idol of Malos also aggros on Z axis.
* Lots of line of sight issues with the “hilly” ground of the new expansion. Possible geometry fix to see more “lines” between the mob and the player.
* Request to make many click items useable from inventory. Zajeer is opposed to doing this globally since some global items are balanced around being worn (wizard pants, slow stick, etc). It might be possible for some older items, on a case by case basis.
* Make cleric AC buffs group versions. Prathun says this sounds reasonable, particularly with buff blocking now.
* More all/all clicky illusion items. Class balance issue with enchanters.
* Bind items to hotkeys. For example: /do item 1 /say this in group. Nome looking at.
* Fix LOH so it only works on PCs (not corpses, not mobs).
* Make a group version of the druid spell “lion’s strength”

Future of Everquest

* Level increase in next expansion? Rashere said this is likely. He is not a fan of the idea of AA based level requirements for 2 reasons:
1. Takes the “alternate” out of alternate advancement, since it would be required advancement
2. Would be harder on the casual players who depend on the power increase of leveling up to tackle some content.
* Instanced housing in EQ – not a huge demand. No current plans.
* Consolidate all questing systems into one system.
* The developers really want people to play on the Test server but they would rather people level up on the Test server and not just copy their mains. They need people playing consistently, not just an hour here or there. The Test community is important.
* Any plans to bring the Stormhammer only zone to EQ? Maurauder’s Mire. No.
* Add a banker to the guild lobby? Possible.
* Ferine Avatar is lost if someone runs out of range during the cast. Must wait refresh. Rashere will look at it.
* DON camps – aug pools? Sounds reasonable.
* Loot all button – something they want, just need the time to implement it.
* Out of game guild management via EQ players. Rashere says that looks interesting.
* EQ voice chat? Good suggestion.
* Difficulties earning raid/group leader experience. Hard to get leader when someone else in group with more abilities would be more beneficial. Possibility of “mentoring system” where a group leader could share group/raid experience with another player.
* No plans to update new kinds of tribute, but might be a good time to add new tribute options.
* Developers are okay with the current twice a year expansion release schedule. Maybe we will get more information on the next expansion at E3?


Other

* Enchanter – doing the epic quest killed faction so the person can no longer use the Return Home button. Wants a way to improve “one way” factions, like if a wood elf worships RZ, they are automatically KOS in POG.
* Vahlar is interested in new ways to bring lore into the game for everyone. There were some suggestions like right clicking on a statue and learning who the statue is supposed to represent or books that can be found by players that will open lore in a library. Vahlar also said that a compiled list of expansion lore will be posted online soon.
* Issues with Bazaar buy ability – people want to see who is shopping for what. Also, Ngreth to look into changing the size of the default UI which doesn’t clearly show the buy price (some scammers are taking advantage).
* Can you tribute attuneable items? No drop can not be tributed.
* More suffix titles please. Very popular. There will also be a suffix for killing Mayong.
* /target name needs a much bigger range. Rashere said the smaller range was to prevent abuse (targeting people behind a wall or that you couldn’t see). They will look at it.
* Current issue with Find PC (group AA ability). Collision issue. Should be resolved when collision issues are resolved.
* Currently, bards are better pullers than monks. How to improve monk pulling without disturbing class balance.
* Shaman AC caps – less than clerics, more than druids. Zajeer confirmed that plate priests should tank better than chain priests.
* Display mob debuff timers. Rashere said this was interesting.
* Possibility of adding “raid spells” that could be cast on the entire raid – like ports.
Last edited by Gloriana on Mon Apr 10, 2006 1:23 pm, edited 6 times in total.



I bring you gold and silver moons,
And diamond stars, and mists that float.
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Postby Gloriana » Sun Apr 09, 2006 2:46 pm

losing batter power - have to finish from home....
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Postby Samanna » Sun Apr 09, 2006 2:55 pm

Nice writeup!
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Postby Jaraman » Sun Apr 09, 2006 3:11 pm

Very nice indeed, Glori. Tons of topics touched, and quite a few answers, too!

Man, tho, with that huge wishlist tho we sure are keeping the Devs busy.... and what happened to a 10th spell gem?

The best solution is not either/or, but best-of.
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Postby ThraallFV » Sun Apr 09, 2006 3:18 pm

very nice, and i saw at least one place where they answered a question with a No, but with a good explaination. i like people that respond.
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Postby Gloriana » Mon Apr 10, 2006 12:16 am

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Postby Henora » Mon Apr 10, 2006 4:05 am

, shaman of - Terris Thule ( now The Rathe )
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Re: Fan Faire Report!

Postby Caythy » Mon Apr 10, 2006 6:59 am

Shaman - the other chain wearing and spell casting melee.
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Re: Fan Faire Report!

Postby Galelor » Mon Apr 10, 2006 10:52 am

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Postby Galelor » Mon Apr 10, 2006 10:56 am

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Postby Aruman » Mon Apr 10, 2006 11:58 am


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Postby Xodar » Mon Apr 10, 2006 12:23 pm

Plainswalker Xodar
officer <Bhur Gcairde>
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Re: Fan Faire Report!

Postby Jaraman » Mon Apr 10, 2006 12:40 pm

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Postby Gloriana » Mon Apr 10, 2006 12:58 pm

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Postby Samanna » Mon Apr 10, 2006 2:00 pm

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Postby Unmei » Mon Apr 10, 2006 2:10 pm

Druid Knockback root is , which, I -believe- is their DoD 69 spell.
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Postby Aruman » Mon Apr 10, 2006 2:17 pm

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Postby xilly » Mon Apr 10, 2006 2:56 pm

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Postby Samanna » Mon Apr 10, 2006 3:08 pm

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Postby JyveAFK » Mon Apr 10, 2006 3:26 pm

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Postby Gloriana » Mon Apr 10, 2006 3:28 pm

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Postby Gloriana » Mon Apr 10, 2006 3:41 pm

Jyve the rockstar!

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Re: Fan Faire Report! (updated with the rest!)

Postby Tugela » Mon Apr 10, 2006 6:10 pm



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Postby XeroOmega » Mon Apr 10, 2006 6:28 pm


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Postby Korvath » Mon Apr 10, 2006 7:55 pm

Did the picture above make anyone else wonder what the two men in the audience were looking at? They obviously had their attention focused elsewhere, so I took the liberty to reveal that which kept their attention over the so dubbed "rockstar of karaoke".

The man in the black shirt obviously has his attention fixated on the pole I highlighted in red. Maybe he is trying to bend it with telekinetic power... "There is no pole.."

The man with the hat was harder to conclude to what he was looking at. My guess is he was either looking at the box I highlighted, trying to decide what kind of tape it had on it's corners, or looking at the small gremlin trying to get Jyve's attention. I can only imagine why the gremlin is there, who knows, maybe Jyve's singing woke it from eons of slumber.

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Postby JyveAFK » Mon Apr 10, 2006 8:05 pm

I thought I felt something scratching my leg.
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Postby Kanamori Hitatomi » Mon Apr 10, 2006 8:47 pm


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SHAMMYKNIGHT !!! Okay, perhaps I'm now less of a speedbump than fluffy was when we first got him...
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Postby Tharkis » Mon Apr 10, 2006 9:31 pm

Hope my bandwidth keeps up with the demand for all the people everywhere linking to my pics =) hehe

FF was awsome, and yes Jyve is a true bard, he rocked the house. He was the first person to actually get up and do kareoke (there was a woman before him... but the woman worked for the band, an icebreaker so to speak)
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Postby Tinici » Mon Apr 10, 2006 9:41 pm

Last edited by Tinici on Mon Apr 10, 2006 10:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Gloriana » Mon Apr 10, 2006 10:04 pm

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