Complacency, pt 2.... shammy DPS

[Jaraman]

[Samanna]

[siludorf]

[Aruman]

[ophidion]

[Bigcat Daddy-o]

[Chutoi]

[ophidion]

[Mukshaak]

[jdthomas]

No matter who's dps you want to call it, I still /mourn original panther. Yeah it was probably bad for the game, but it was soooooo good.

[Beafly]

I think I know the answer, but maybe some numbers from the smart people might shed a different light on our current discussion.

I've heard before that Bard + 3 Rogues > 4 rogues. Does the same equation work for shaman? Shaman + 3 rogues > 4 rogues?

[siludorf]

I'm not sure, but I know that shaman+bard+3 rogues+zerker is the best combo w/o moving people around.

And Ophidion,.. you need to read what Chutoi linked, it specifically said we were the best, but now we're not the best. (Mages can now debuff just as much as us.. they get malosnia as well).

[Jaraman]

[Bigsnack For'Mobs]

[Brohg]

[Jaraman]

I only have a couple moments here to reply, but I will try to present some numbers for comparison. This area is open for HUGE debate or correction, please keep that in mind. Adjustments later.

Lets' assume that we are talking about Qvic geared classes, 500 AA. Also assume that the classes here are trying to put out decent DPS (bard meleeing, chanter nuking, priest healing), while doing their primary duties. These are numbers that the class can reasonably sustain in one minute group battles, not burst DPS or extreme instances of trying to push for harder numbers.

350 DPS and below
cleric
bard
pally
SK
warrior
druid
enchanter

350-500 DPS
shaman
beastlord
ranger
monk

500+ DPS
wizard
mage
zerker
necro
rogue

EDIT #1: Obviously I'm no expert on these numbers. Anyone have any better numbers, please post. I moved enchanter up, I don't know why I had wizzy in the wrong place. The 500+ is no particular order. Any other corrections, feel free to add to the hooey. I'm trying to give Big Daddy and other pre-Anguish shaman some rough estimates so they had an idea where shaman sit DPS wise in groups, not raids. I have no frigging idea how Anguish and beyond parse, because I'm not there....this chart is not for uber end folks cuz you already know where you sit. Not everyone is end-game.

EDIT #2: Simplified the breakdown to 350 and below, 350-500, 500+. For reference 350 DPS = 21,000 damage, 500 DPS = 30,000 damage.

[Giac]

[Unmei]

[Giac]

[siludorf]

[Ughbash]

[Unmei]

[Giac]

[Scowls]

[Chutoi]

[Scowls]

[Brohg]

[Unmei]

[Brohg]

I'm not at home, but I'll dig up parses. They burn discs & shit, like all melee do, including some wonky-looking ones like the garg pets that look different than normal discs. Mostly it comes from looting for it and setting up for it. Cleave/Fero foci, offhand DK w/ tunat aug, highish accuracy & cfx, making rogues & berserkers actually use their group discs instead of blowing it off, timing epic effects & discs together, all that usual stuff that makes good parses for everyone. Good bards (by which I mean three out of four in my guild, not just the class rep Mojo) nearly always exceed knight dps in all situations but paladins on undead.

[Unmei]

[Brohg]

[Ughbash]

[belaar]

[Jaraman]

[Chutoi]

[Sunchyne]

Hi everyone, long time reader, first time poster.

(This is part of a post I posted over at the MB forums, but I figured yall would be interested in the numbers also.)

I come from a guild that clears Anguish - OMM, DoN - Vish (55% or so latest), Tacvi, and have one blood raid down with 2 more going down soon. So I'm around the middle of the high end spectrum. I parse every raid I lead, and usually have a couple others that parse so I can back up my information.

This parse is from Zun'Muram Shaldn Boc (Tacvi), who we usually get all buffed out to fight.


- this is our 1 berserker, had 2.9K atk on the fight -
194, 001 total damage
2179 total DPS over 1:29


- had 2.85 K atk on the fight -
159,405 total damage
1410 total DPS over 1:53


- had 2.9 K atk on the fight -
138,998 total damage
1263 total DPS over 1:50


- had 2.6 K atk on the fight -
136,789 total damage
1210 total DPS over 1:53

Now, we were all in the same group, had a 2.0 shaman, 1.5 bard, dont think the bard got off his click until the last 20% of the fight, shaman clicked at 98%, I got in 1 2.0 click and the berserker and rogue did the same. None of us have 7th vet AA. We all had the same buffs, hunter/fero/haste. I think the zerker had atk clicky from time.

Granted, this is a very short fight, but this is usually around how our parses run, with me and the rogue switching out places depending on the mob and/or positioning. We have another 2.0 monk that usually runs in our DPS group that parse a little less than me usually. Obviously, our rogue did slack some, as she usually hits 1.5 to 1.6 DPS on that fight. The warrior is our top warrior, and a very good one. He knows how to use his character to the best of its abilities, so I'm not sure if I would assume every warrior will hit that kind of DPS, even on a short fight such as that one.

Other DPS numbers for this fight -

Wizards - 600 - 800 DPS - Our wizards are slack, and they would be the first to admit it to you. Although, they do die a lot, due to our tanks kind of "slacking" on the aggro part. I have seen our wizards hit a lot higher than this, but usually dont break into the top 5 or top 10, depending on resists and length of fight.
Bard - 450 DPS - was wielding Tacvi blade and 1.5.
Shadowknights - 400-500 - no 2.0 SK's yet, but they are either using Mourgecaller + shield or Greatsword of Mortification.
Other warriors - Average around 400-600 DPS, using BBoB + 2.0/1.5 (about half of them have 2.0's).
Enchanter 350-400 - Has ancient nuke, and was probably putting out some DoT damage also.
Necromancers - I was informed by our 2 necromancers that actively parse themselves they were doing around 1000 DPS. Also, on such a short fight, there is not much ramp up time, as yall know, so I usually expect them to do 1100-1500 depending on the length of the fight and AE's, etc.
Ranger - 975 - Depending on group set up, I.E. with a bard/shaman or not, our rangers average 900 - 1500 DPS. Bards really bump up a rangers DPS, due to the fact their aura effects their nukes and melee, and a shaman 2.0 click effects HoA and melee. HoA is usually around 25-50% of their DPS, dependent on if they pop trueshot or not.
Paladin - 400 - Our 2.0 paladin can usually break 400, and hit 500 on a lucky run of the RNG. With undead, expect that number to be MUCH higher.
Magician - None
Beastlord - 550 -Depending on if you factor in their warder and DoD pet, our Beastlords put out around 500-800 DPS for us.
Shaman - the one shaman I talked to that parses himself, told me he hit 960 DPS on that fight, including his pets. I'm not sure what DoT's he used, but he is always on top of his game.
Druid - Healing

Sorry for the long post, but I figured this information would be a bit pertinent to the overall DPS question I saw raised in this thread. The fact of the matter, though, is this single parse really doesn't represent a good overall spread of damage. It is a very short fight, which limits a few classes. It does, however, kind of give you an idea of what classes can do. The person playing the class has a HUGE amount to do with the DPS that class can pump out. I do have parses from all of our Anguish, DoN, and DoD runs. Usually the placement of people is about the same, but the DPS varies greatly due to the length of the fight and any AE's during it. Also, positioning is a huge factor. Every fight is different, but for our guilds make up, it usually looks like :

Berserker => Rogue => Monk = Ranger => Wizard = Magician => Beastlord = Warrior => Bard = Shadowknight = Paladin => Enchanter with our necromancers, druids, and shaman falling anywhere in that list due to healing/ramp up time/other duties they have to perform. Also, I would like to point out, group placement is a large part of DPS also, as a bard can effect melee and caster DPS, and a 2.0 shaman can really ramp up a melee's DPS.

Edit : Clarity

[Unmei]

[Sunchyne]

[Brohg]

[Sunchyne]